raymond frantz

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Posts by raymond frantz

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  19

  U turn on LGBT

  by ExBethelitenowPIMA in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  feb broadcast they have a drama about someone who works with a colleague who is gay.. they actually make it sound like the jws are the only ones who support him and is tolerant of him and everyone else is against him🤣.

  after all these years they try gaslighting and saying we are the ones who are tolerant and everyone else is not!!!.

  you couldn’t make this up.. after this monumental u turn now, what about all the gay people who were born in’s who have been shunned by their own family?.

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  raymond frantz

  Yes this was a slightly departure for sure
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  12

  New Footage of the Kingdom Hall that Recetly Was Converted to a Mosque

  by raymond frantz in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  https://youtu.be/2rovtysbopm?si=gqazzq-lowyk3js0.

  with islam being one of the fastest-growing religions in the uk, there’s more need for mosques.

  so when an old church goes up for sale, it’s not exactly surprising that someone might want to turn it into a mosque.

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  raymond frantz

  https://youtu.be/2roVtYSbOpM?si=gqAzZQ-lowyK3jS0

  With Islam being one of the fastest-growing religions in the UK, there’s more need for mosques. So when an old church goes up for sale, it’s not exactly surprising that someone might want to turn it into a mosque. Makes sense, right? Well, not so fast because unlike Jehovah’s Witnesses the Church of England is putting up a fight.
  Take what happened in Hanley, Staffordshire last year. A group called the Zamir Foundation bought a disused Anglican church and got permission to convert it into a mosque. But before they could even roll out the prayer mats, the Church of England stepped in and said, "Not so fast."
  Turns out, when the church was sold back in 2009, a little legal clause was tucked into the paperwork saying the building could never be used for worship by another religion. So, despite it being empty for decades, despite the fact that no one from the Church of England was actually using it, and despite the fact that a growing community needed a place to pray, the answer was still a firm “no.”
  Now, this isn’t a one-off. The Church of England has been doing this for years. Whenever they sell off a church, they slap on a "no other religions" rule, making sure it never becomes a mosque, temple, or anything else that isn’t Christian. You’ve got to admire their commitment to the brand.
  But here’s where it gets really interesting. While the Anglicans are busy protecting their old churches from becoming mosques, Jehovah’s Witnesses couldn’t care less, yes these pompous Kingdom Hall dedication talks were for the birds.
  Unlike the Church of England, they don’t bother with any legal nonsense about who can buy them or what they can be turned into. Mosque? Sure. Hindu temple? Why not. Office space? Go for it. As long as the cheque clears, it’s yours.
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  3026

  It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)

  by Simon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  uh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.

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  raymond frantz

  Sorry Lloyd we don't any pedophile scum back home, we have enough already with the local Pakistani rape gangs...and i want to keep you true to your word that you will never join Jehovah’s Witnesses again...you're not getting out of this one you slimeball
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  3026

  It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)

  by Simon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  uh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.

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  raymond frantz

  I believe he is planning to return to the UK and since he doesn't want to work a minial job he will try to come back to daddy who has a big house with many bedrooms and go on disability allowance which is quite common. Also, I will not put it past him to reintegrate with the local congregation ,we have many bend elders who will have him reinstated although he was and has been the greatest and baddest apostate in the world. I won't even put it past him for him to even have a part at a local assembly when he tells the world how he came back to Jehovah.

  Thankfully due to a large community of "friends" in the area the police will be notified upon his arrival, there is an open warrant against him, and the UK Bethel asking sure the local elders do not have him back😁
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  3

  Are Jehovah's Witnesses the Most Persecuted Christians on Earth?

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  https://youtu.be/ogxeebmjgyq?si=yowzsbtvmjlzdakd.

  https://www.opendoors.org/en-us/persecution/countries/.

  the 2024 open doors world watch list for the most persecuted christans is out, spotlighting the top countries where christians face brutal persecution for their faith.

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  raymond frantz

  https://youtu.be/OgXeebMjgYQ?si=yowZsBtvmjLZdAkD

  https://www.opendoors.org/en-US/persecution/countries/

  The 2024 Open Doors World Watch List for the most persecuted Christans is out, spotlighting the top countries where Christians face brutal persecution for their faith. And what do we see? The usual heavyweights topping the list: North Korea, Afghanistan, Somalia, Libya, and Pakistan. These nations are like persecution Olympians, consistently going for gold in the oppression games. Christians in these countries live under constant threat of death, imprisonment, and systemic oppression. Yet amidst this grim reality, one group is notably absent: Jehovah’s Witnesses. That’s right, the self-proclaimed "most persecuted religion" is nowhere to be found in these metrics. This glaring omission begs the question: is the Watchtower’s narrative about unparalleled persecution falling flat on its face? Spoiler alert: it is.

  Let’s start by examining why Christians are persecuted in these countries. In places like North Korea, Afghanistan, and Somalia, the mere act of owning a Bible or being suspected of attending a secret church service can lead to imprisonment, torture, or execution. Christians are often targeted because they refuse to renounce their faith, engage in ministry, or protect their houses of worship against hostile regimes and extremist groups. The persecution is severe, systematic, and unrelenting. North Korea, as usual, holds the dubious distinction of being the worst offender. There, Christians are treated as enemies of the state, often rounded up with their families and shipped off to brutal labor camps. Afghanistan, now under Taliban rule, offers a similar fate, where being exposed as a Christian is tantamount to a death sentence. In Somalia, Libya, and Pakistan, believers face threats ranging from forced conversions to mob violence and murder. These are not one-off incidents; they are systemic and entrenched forms of oppression targeting entire communities.

  And where are Jehovah’s Witnesses in all of this? Nowhere. Their absence from these metrics is as deafening as their door-knocking is persistent. Why? Because the reasons Christians face persecution in these countries are fundamentally different from the challenges Jehovah’s Witnesses encounter. Most Christians are persecuted for their active ministry in totalitarian or Islamic regimes, where their faith is seen as a threat to the status quo. They’re targeted for building and protecting houses of worship, often standing as visible symbols of resistance against regimes that seek to suppress any form of dissent. In stark contrast, the Watchtower has virtually no presence in these hotspots. Their absence from countries like North Korea, Afghanistan, and Somalia isn’t because they’re stealthy or underground. It’s because they’ve chosen not to plant roots in places where their theology or organizational structure would put them in real danger.

  Now let’s talk about those houses of worship. For Christians in many of these countries, their churches are sacred spaces. These buildings are more than just places to gather; they’re symbols of faith and community, often defended at great personal risk. Many Christians have died protecting their churches from destruction or desecration by hostile forces. Contrast this with the Jehovah’s Witnesses, whose Kingdom Halls are treated more like real estate investments than sacred spaces. When financial pressures mount or membership numbers dwindle, the Watchtower is quick to sell off Kingdom Halls to the highest bidder. In some cases, they’ve even sold properties to developers, pocketing the profits without a second thought for the local congregations. For an organization that prides itself on being the “most spiritual,” their pragmatic approach to real estate is, to put it mildly, revealing.

  But what about the persecution Jehovah’s Witnesses do face? It’s true that they’ve encountered challenges in places like Russia and Eritrea. In Russia, for instance, the government labeled them as extremists in 2017, leading to the confiscation of properties, raids, and arrests. Eritrea has similarly targeted them, primarily for their refusal to participate in military service. These are serious issues, but they’re isolated compared to the widespread, systemic persecution faced by Christians in the countries topping the World Watch List. Consider this: in Russia, about 643 Jehovah’s Witnesses have been charged with extremism-related offenses. In Eritrea, 64 members are currently imprisoned. Meanwhile, in countries like North Korea, Afghanistan, and Somalia, entire underground Christian communities numbering in the thousands are at risk of annihilation. The scale and severity are simply not comparable.

  And then there’s the matter of ministry. Jehovah’s Witnesses are often praised within their own circles for their dedication to preaching, but let’s be honest: their approach is fundamentally different from the bold, sacrificial ministry that puts Christians in danger in many of these countries. Traditional Christians often engage in social services, run underground churches, and risk their lives to bring hope to oppressed communities. Jehovah’s Witnesses, on the other hand, stick to their door-to-door campaigns, which, while admirable in its persistence, rarely puts them in the line of fire in the same way. Their strategy is more about controlled growth within safe boundaries than risking life and limb for their faith.

  And let’s not forget the Watchtower’s knack for playing the victim card. Their narrative hinges on the idea that they are the most persecuted religious group in the world, but the numbers simply don’t back this up. If anything, their absence from the World Watch List metrics highlights the gap between their rhetoric and reality. While other Christians are enduring unspeakable hardships for their faith, the Watchtower seems more focused on legal battles over zoning laws and property disputes than on standing firm in the face of existential threats.

  So, what can we take away from all this? First, the persecution of Christians worldwide is a devastating reality that deserves attention and action. The believers in North Korea, Afghanistan, and Somalia aren’t just statistics; they’re human beings suffering for their faith in ways most of us can’t imagine. Second, the Watchtower’s narrative of being the “most persecuted” is, to put it bluntly, a stretch. Yes, Jehovah’s Witnesses face challenges in some countries, but the scale and nature of their experiences are not comparable to what’s happening in the hotspots identified by Open Doors.

  In the end, the absence of Jehovah’s Witnesses from the World Watch List metrics isn’t just an oversight; it’s a reality check. The narrative they’ve crafted doesn’t hold up under scrutiny, especially when compared to the widespread and systemic persecution faced by other Christians. So, the next time the Watchtower cries persecution, maybe take it with a grain of salt—or better yet, an entire shaker. Meanwhile, let’s keep our focus where it belongs: on the believers who are truly paying the ultimate price for their faith, often in silence, and without the luxury of spinning their suffering into a PR campaign
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  25

  Why the WATCHTOWER doesn't believe in the GREAT APOSTASY but you should!

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  https://youtu.be/i4uttjj7eus?si=0b-fzpqm8axb_d3p.

  in its latest april 2025 watchtower study article 17 and paragraph 12 the watchtower promotes 2 dangerous lies that will cost your life if you are a believing christian during the time of the end, so i'm considering today the first lie in the first part of the paragraph, but first let's read the paragraph itself: "today, jehovah promises to provide us with spiritual protection.

  he will never allow satan to corrupt true worship.

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  raymond frantz

  Quick questions about preterists here: according to 2 Thess. 2:8

  8 Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence.

  If Nero was the Antichrist:

  1. How was he revealed?

  2. How did Jesus do away with him with the spirit of his mouth?

  3. What exactly is the spirit of his mouth?

  4. And when did the manifestation of his presence take place?
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  6

  Even DEMONS were conned by the org into believing 1975 was the end!

  by BoogerMan in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  yb71 p. 97 country reports (part one) - "in malta there is a monk reputed to have the powers of a seer, in the confessional being able to know a person’s sins before they are even confessed.

  a woman in one of the villages was having family trouble, and made a journey to this confessor in the hope of getting some hidden information by the monk’s psychic powers.

  after being told of the problem, the monk said: “don’t worry about it, my dear, the end of all things is very near!” another woman in the same village, somewhat opposed to the truth, told this to her husband, who is having a bible study.

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  raymond frantz

  That's brilliant @BoogerMan more stories please 🤣🤣🤣
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  32

  Whatever Happened to Those who returned to JEHOVAH

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  https://youtu.be/3yylzu0bi_k?si=kku6r9szfenj3h9i.

  whatever happened to those who came back to jehovah?

  due to slow growth and the constant scrutiny from governments like norway in relation to their harsh disfellowshipping practices,last year in a move that no one expected the watchtower for the first time extended an olive branch to all those who left the organization or were disfellowshipped in the past.considering this practice was introduced over 60 years ago and with a rough estimate that around 100,000 leave jehovah’s witnesses every year the total number is in the several millions.so we should have expected millions to have accepted this invitation and rejoined the organization, the result though was an abysmal few thousands according to a recent jw update.. so now, for the first time, the latest watchtower study magazine for april 2025 gives us an inside view on how this reintegration is coming along, and it doesn't look good!.

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  raymond frantz

  https://youtu.be/3YYLzu0bI_k?si=kKu6r9sZFeNJ3h9i

  Whatever happened to those who came back to Jehovah? Due to slow growth and the constant scrutiny from governments like Norway in relation to their harsh disfellowshipping practices,last year in a move that no one expected the Watchtower for the first time extended an olive branch to all those who left the organization or were disfellowshipped in the past.Considering this practice was introduced over 60 years ago and with a rough estimate that around 100,000 leave Jehovah’s Witnesses every year the total number is in the several millions.So we should have expected millions to have accepted this invitation and rejoined the organization, the result though was an abysmal few thousands according to a recent jw update.

  So now, for the first time, the latest Watchtower Study Magazine for April 2025 gives us an inside view on how this reintegration is coming along, and it doesn't look good!

  Paragraph 14 Study Article 16.

  "We can also prevent divisions in the congregation by striving to be refreshing and upbuilding to others at all times. (1 Thess. 5:11) In recent times, a number of people who were inactive or who were removed from the congregation have returned. We warmly welcome them! (2 Cor. 2:8) Note what happened to one sister who returned to the Kingdom Hall after being inactive for ten years. She said, “I was greeted with smiles and handshakes.” (Acts 3:19). How did those simple kindnesses affect her? She says, “It made me feel that Jehovah’s hand was guiding me back to happiness.” By being upbuilding to all, we can be used by Christ to provide refreshment to those “who are toiling and loaded down.”​—Matt. 11:28, 29.

  So what can we glean from this?

  For decades, the Jehovah’s Witnesses have upheld disfellowshipping as a cornerstone of their discipline. Millions have been removed from their congregations for various reasons, ranging from doctrinal disagreements to perceived moral failings. Yet, the organization now seems to be shifting gears, extending an olive branch to those they once cast out or who quietly faded into inactivity. On the surface, this effort appears warm and inviting—who doesn’t love a comeback story? But a closer look reveals an awkward truth: very few of these lost sheep are actually returning to the fold.

  When we talk about “a number” of returnees, as mentioned in the Watchtower’s recent material, it’s hard to ignore the glaring scale mismatch. Millions have been disfellowshipped over the past 60 years, and only a small fraction of that number has come back. A few thousand returning may sound nice in theory, but in practice, it’s more like trying to refill a swimming pool with a teacup. The organization’s portrayal of these reunions, however, is unfailingly upbeat. We’re told of smiles, handshakes, and a sister who felt “Jehovah’s hand” guiding her back to happiness. It’s a tidy narrative, perfect for publication, but it doesn’t reflect the complex, often painful reality of reintegration.My experience from my congregation is of that of one sister that was disfellowshipped for adultery in the past and now lives with her now worldly husband, she was reinstated immediately after this new policy came into effect because one of the elders was a close friend of hers and she has never been to a meeting since, so basically she only got herself reinstated so she can see her family again.So much for the Watchtower’s narrative.My understanding is that these people are dead weight for the Watchtower nothing to offer to them either monetary or participation in the congregations weekly activities.

  Now, if that's the kind of new members they want back in, I'm afraid that's no help to them or the congregation.What has been your experience? Let me know in the comment section.

  The truth is, coming back after years of disfellowshipping or inactivity isn’t as simple as walking through the doors of the Kingdom Hall and being greeted like a long-lost family member. For many, the congregation is an entirely different place from what they remember, and the emotional weight of years spent shunned by their closest friends and family lingers heavily. A few polite smiles and obligatory handshakes might help break the ice, but they don’t erase the trauma of being cut off or the scepticism about whether things have really changed. The very fact that the organization feels the need to remind members to be “refreshing and upbuilding” when someone returns hints at an underlying tension. Why would this need to be emphasized unless there’s a concern that not everyone will be as thrilled about these reunions as the articles suggest?

  For the congregation, welcoming back inactive or disfellowshipped members presents its own challenges. The disfellowshipping policy has long been justified as a way to protect the flock from negative influences, with those removed often viewed as spiritually dangerous. Reintegration, then, requires a significant mental shift for active Witnesses, too, who have been conditioned to avoid or even fear these individuals. Suddenly, being told to embrace them as brothers and sisters again isn’t always easy—or, in some cases, entirely believable.

  It’s also worth asking why the organization is concentrating on this effort now. For decades, disfellowshipping was presented as a loving form of discipline, even when it resulted in heartbreaking consequences like fractured families and social isolation. Now, there’s an unmistakable push to bring these people back. Is it out of genuine concern for their spiritual well-being, or is it motivated by something less altruistic? Membership growth among Jehovah’s Witnesses has been slowing in recent years, and the rise of online ex-JW communities has given former members a powerful platform to share their experiences. Could this renewed attention on welcoming back the disfellowshipped be, at least in part, damage control?

  Whatever the motivation, the Watchtower’s approach to reintegration seems overly simplistic. Smiles and handshakes are nice, but they don’t address the deep wounds caused by the policy of shunning. Many who leave the organization spend years rebuilding their lives, finding new support systems, and coming to terms with their experiences. For these individuals, returning to the very system that caused their pain isn’t an easy choice—and often, it’s not a choice they’re willing to make at all.

  The reality is that bringing inactive and disfellowshipped members back into the congregation requires more than a few magazine articles and a handful of anecdotal success stories. It demands a fundamental reassessment of how the organization treats those who falter, disagree, or simply drift away. Without addressing the root causes of the alienation, any attempt at reconciliation risks being little more than a Band-Aid on a much deeper wound. For now, it seems the Watchtower’s warm welcome has left a lot of seats at the Kingdom Halls still conspicuously empty despite their hope for the opposite, but we will have to wait and see
• 
  3026

  It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)

  by Simon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  uh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.

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  raymond frantz

  Since he doesn't believe in God anymore what he describes from a Christian point of view is him giving his body over to demons, you just can't make this stuff up, you need to listen to the end
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  25

  Why the WATCHTOWER doesn't believe in the GREAT APOSTASY but you should!

  by raymond frantz in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  https://youtu.be/i4uttjj7eus?si=0b-fzpqm8axb_d3p.

  in its latest april 2025 watchtower study article 17 and paragraph 12 the watchtower promotes 2 dangerous lies that will cost your life if you are a believing christian during the time of the end, so i'm considering today the first lie in the first part of the paragraph, but first let's read the paragraph itself: "today, jehovah promises to provide us with spiritual protection.

  he will never allow satan to corrupt true worship.

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  raymond frantz

  I got some really good friends that are preterists and very well versed , have discussed this claim on everything having been full filed in the first century AD, it fails on scrutiny and of course on the main idea that all prophesy is well behind us which contradicts Peter's statement that prophesy is like a lamp shining in a dark place.(2 Peter 1:19)We live in very dark times and believing preterism means that God has left us in total darkness, which makes no sense.